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	<title>Comments on: Yahoo Open Hack Day Taiwan 2009</title>
	<atom:link href="http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/2009/10/21/pr-issue-of-yahoo-ohd/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/2009/10/21/pr-issue-of-yahoo-ohd/</link>
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		<title>By: Rex Tsai</title>
		<link>http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/2009/10/21/pr-issue-of-yahoo-ohd/comment-page-1/#comment-207068</link>
		<dc:creator>Rex Tsai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Oct 2009 06:32:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/?p=1494#comment-207068</guid>
		<description>@Polprav You are free to do so. :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Polprav You are free to do so. <img src='http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/wp-includes/images/smilies/yahoo_smiley.gif' alt='&#58;&#45;&#41;' class='wp-smiley' width='18' height='18' title='&#58;&#45;&#41;' /></p>
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		<title>By: Polprav</title>
		<link>http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/2009/10/21/pr-issue-of-yahoo-ohd/comment-page-1/#comment-207066</link>
		<dc:creator>Polprav</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Oct 2009 04:53:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/?p=1494#comment-207066</guid>
		<description>Hello from Russia!
Can I quote a post in your blog with the link to you?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello from Russia!<br />
Can I quote a post in your blog with the link to you?</p>
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		<title>By: Rex Tsai</title>
		<link>http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/2009/10/21/pr-issue-of-yahoo-ohd/comment-page-1/#comment-207063</link>
		<dc:creator>Rex Tsai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:06:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/?p=1494#comment-207063</guid>
		<description>@tan, Can not agree with you! Every big companies in Taiwan are doing the same thing, and they are doing so are because not only the media and the audience like the tone.

If you can not agree with me, go back and check your own flickr to see how many booth babe photos in your albums. :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@tan, Can not agree with you! Every big companies in Taiwan are doing the same thing, and they are doing so are because not only the media and the audience like the tone.</p>
<p>If you can not agree with me, go back and check your own flickr to see how many booth babe photos in your albums. <img src='http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/wp-includes/images/smilies/yahoo_smiley.gif' alt='&#58;&#45;&#41;' class='wp-smiley' width='18' height='18' title='&#58;&#45;&#41;' /></p>
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		<title>By: tan</title>
		<link>http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/2009/10/21/pr-issue-of-yahoo-ohd/comment-page-1/#comment-207062</link>
		<dc:creator>tan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 10:49:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/?p=1494#comment-207062</guid>
		<description>i&#039;m from taiwan. i would say it&#039;s simply ridiculous to point the finger on so-called &quot;sick media culture&quot;. it&#039;s not true. Yahoo in Taiwan has used this tactics many times, mainly use pretty young girls to attract eyeballs, only it backfires this time. they deserved it:)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i&#8217;m from taiwan. i would say it&#8217;s simply ridiculous to point the finger on so-called &#8220;sick media culture&#8221;. it&#8217;s not true. Yahoo in Taiwan has used this tactics many times, mainly use pretty young girls to attract eyeballs, only it backfires this time. they deserved it<img src='http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/wp-includes/images/smilies/yahoo_smiley.gif' alt='&#58;&#41;' class='wp-smiley' width='18' height='18' title='&#58;&#41;' /></p>
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		<title>By: Fred Chien</title>
		<link>http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/2009/10/21/pr-issue-of-yahoo-ohd/comment-page-1/#comment-207061</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Chien</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 08:42:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/?p=1494#comment-207061</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve been there as well, I think Yahoo! has a good intentions to prepare a very short term show to let players to take a break. As a player who hard to work on creations,  I don&#039;t like this show personally, it makes a lot of noise to effect my thinking.

Indeed, the performance is no problem, the problem is performers overdo I think.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been there as well, I think Yahoo! has a good intentions to prepare a very short term show to let players to take a break. As a player who hard to work on creations,  I don&#8217;t like this show personally, it makes a lot of noise to effect my thinking.</p>
<p>Indeed, the performance is no problem, the problem is performers overdo I think.</p>
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		<title>By: Rex Tsai</title>
		<link>http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/2009/10/21/pr-issue-of-yahoo-ohd/comment-page-1/#comment-207060</link>
		<dc:creator>Rex Tsai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 08:23:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/?p=1494#comment-207060</guid>
		<description>I agreed with both of you. 

However, in my post. I simply ask you to see this thing in a different angle as native. I am saying in the local &lt;b&gt;distorted&lt;/b&gt; culture, that&#039;s common. The SG and dancing girl are hired as professional like programmers, to deliver their works. 

And it becomes so, mostly because the sick media culture. Most of these media may report the debate and also promote other IT event with SGs at the same. And hire SG for IT events has been accepted as kind of popular culture, which can not be denied.

And even local female programmers are getting used to it (sadly). The lap dancing is more like a result for satisfy the media, the local people might see it naturally only for marketing benefit. Before Simon Willison covered this, all the local news are only reported this event with a SG in photos.

It&#039;s a big PR mistake for Yahoo as global company. But it&#039;s even big mistake for the local feminism communities who has been ignored this for years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agreed with both of you. </p>
<p>However, in my post. I simply ask you to see this thing in a different angle as native. I am saying in the local <b>distorted</b> culture, that&#8217;s common. The SG and dancing girl are hired as professional like programmers, to deliver their works. </p>
<p>And it becomes so, mostly because the sick media culture. Most of these media may report the debate and also promote other IT event with SGs at the same. And hire SG for IT events has been accepted as kind of popular culture, which can not be denied.</p>
<p>And even local female programmers are getting used to it (sadly). The lap dancing is more like a result for satisfy the media, the local people might see it naturally only for marketing benefit. Before Simon Willison covered this, all the local news are only reported this event with a SG in photos.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a big PR mistake for Yahoo as global company. But it&#8217;s even big mistake for the local feminism communities who has been ignored this for years.</p>
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		<title>By: Kaitlin Duck Sherwood</title>
		<link>http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/2009/10/21/pr-issue-of-yahoo-ohd/comment-page-1/#comment-207059</link>
		<dc:creator>Kaitlin Duck Sherwood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 07:30:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/?p=1494#comment-207059</guid>
		<description>As a woman programmer, I want to comment.  It&#039;s not so much the objectification of women is so bad.  What really wears me down is how entertainment, jokes, stories, *everything* at tech events seems to assume that the audience is all male.  That sends the message to women, &quot;This event is not for you.&quot;

Imagine, men, if you were at a tech event, and there was a woman emcee who kept cracking jokes which had lines like, &quot;You know how your boobs get sore right before your period?&quot;  

Or that instead of giving away XL t-shirts with the name of the sponsors on it, gave away bras with logos?  Or if the entertainment consisted of male strippers?  You would pretty quickly start to feel like you were not in the right place.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a woman programmer, I want to comment.  It&#8217;s not so much the objectification of women is so bad.  What really wears me down is how entertainment, jokes, stories, *everything* at tech events seems to assume that the audience is all male.  That sends the message to women, &#8220;This event is not for you.&#8221;</p>
<p>Imagine, men, if you were at a tech event, and there was a woman emcee who kept cracking jokes which had lines like, &#8220;You know how your boobs get sore right before your period?&#8221;  </p>
<p>Or that instead of giving away XL t-shirts with the name of the sponsors on it, gave away bras with logos?  Or if the entertainment consisted of male strippers?  You would pretty quickly start to feel like you were not in the right place.</p>
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		<title>By: Meitar Moscovitz</title>
		<link>http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/2009/10/21/pr-issue-of-yahoo-ohd/comment-page-1/#comment-207058</link>
		<dc:creator>Meitar Moscovitz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Oct 2009 06:47:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://people.debian.org.tw/~chihchun/?p=1494#comment-207058</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;[D]on’t blame Yahoo, it’s totally not an issue of sexism of the event, you idiot. It’s about the sicked (local and global) media.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Are you saying that an event isn&#039;t sexist if it simply doesn&#039;t intend to be? Behavior does not extend from intention alone. Regardless of how innocent Yahoo&#039;s intentions might be, I think an event that featured sexualized portrayals of one gender and not another in a context that, as you say, is completely inappropriate to do so (I would get annoyed if I was coding for hours and someone told me to get up and dance, too), is sexist.

Whether you were offended is not is another matter. (Sexism !== offensive) evaluates to true, but (innocent intent !== non-sexist behavior) also evaluates to true.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Please go fight with them if you think the media is sexism, and many Taiwanese is already doing so.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I think by speaking up about the sexism that was displayed by Yahoo!&#039;s actions, they are doing exactly that. How else would you have people protest the idea that objectifying women in the industry is inappropriate, if you don&#039;t want to see them do so in the industry itself?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>[D]on’t blame Yahoo, it’s totally not an issue of sexism of the event, you idiot. It’s about the sicked (local and global) media.</p></blockquote>
<p>Are you saying that an event isn&#8217;t sexist if it simply doesn&#8217;t intend to be? Behavior does not extend from intention alone. Regardless of how innocent Yahoo&#8217;s intentions might be, I think an event that featured sexualized portrayals of one gender and not another in a context that, as you say, is completely inappropriate to do so (I would get annoyed if I was coding for hours and someone told me to get up and dance, too), is sexist.</p>
<p>Whether you were offended is not is another matter. (Sexism !== offensive) evaluates to true, but (innocent intent !== non-sexist behavior) also evaluates to true.</p>
<blockquote><p>Please go fight with them if you think the media is sexism, and many Taiwanese is already doing so.</p></blockquote>
<p>I think by speaking up about the sexism that was displayed by Yahoo!&#8217;s actions, they are doing exactly that. How else would you have people protest the idea that objectifying women in the industry is inappropriate, if you don&#8217;t want to see them do so in the industry itself?</p>
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